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SOHC240
12-26-2001, 08:05 PM
I am going to be upgrading my headlights from sealed beam units to one of the conversions.

Anybody used the matrix Diamond cut projectors? How about the hella's?

Which are the best. Are the hella's really worth all the extra money?

Thanks,
Marshall
Blue 90 hatch.

s13SRmadness
12-26-2001, 08:30 PM
i used the hella's. they're nice, but i'm sure that anything cheaper is probably just as good. http://www.freshalloy.com/

White_240sx
12-27-2001, 11:26 AM
This set-up comes highly recommended.
http://www.clearcorners.com/products/hella/72207/

**DONOTDELETE**
12-27-2001, 08:48 PM
Situation #1:

"gee, look at this.. its a name-brand knock-off with a bunch of foreign writing on the box, and a couple of words in english.. oh, whats that? "xenon" oh okay, I guess these are those $600 xenon kits but for only $30 bucks!"

hehe.. :)

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 180Style:
just goo too ChinaTown $30.00 for a set, cant beat it...
looks nice too

[ 12-27-2001: Message edited by: 180Style ]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

**DONOTDELETE**
12-27-2001, 08:49 PM
Situation #2:

"gee, look at this.. its a name-brand knock-off that allows you to put those cool blue bulbs. all the quality replacements cost $90+, these are only 30 bucks!"
Man oh man, when will you people STOP buying sh1t? :) If its not Hella, its garbage people. Things cost money because they save money. Spend 30 bucks on some midnight moose headlights and thats exactly what you're going to get, a moose on your hood .. and at midnight too! Congrats..

:)


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BlownS13:
I just picked up a cheap set off of ebay from the seller midnightmoose.com

Think I paid around $45 shipped for everything, glass housings, blubs, etc.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

JonCarson
12-27-2001, 10:33 PM
Are they really that worthless?

Please share with us what exactly it is about the $30 units that's so crappy and why.

Thanks

180Style
12-28-2001, 12:20 AM
just goo too ChinaTown $30.00 for a set, cant beat it...
looks nice too

[ 12-27-2001: Message edited by: 180Style ]

BlownS13
12-28-2001, 12:56 AM
I just picked up a cheap set off of ebay from the seller midnightmoose.com

Think I paid around $45 shipped for everything, glass housings, blubs, etc.

BlownS13
12-28-2001, 02:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by old_s13:
Situation #2:

Things cost money because they save money. Spend 30 bucks on some midnight moose headlights and thats exactly what you're going to get, a moose on your hood .. and at midnight too! Congrats..
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Quite happy with my $45 "garbage" , after 9 months still no moose on my hood.


http://www.freshalloy.com/

BlownS13
12-28-2001, 02:46 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by carsonjon:
Please share with us what exactly it is about the $30 units that's so crappy and why.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, we'd love to know. I never said they produced more light than other options. I bought them because they were cheap, produce at least as much light as the regular sealed beams, and gives them a little different look night and day.

KenFuji
12-28-2001, 03:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by carsonjon:
Are they really that worthless?

Please share with us what exactly it is about the $30 units that's so crappy and why.

Thanks<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

old_s13 is very passionate of his lights http://www.freshalloy.com/

it's like this........
either you what a hyndai or bmw. geo or a nissan

they're both cars and both may last over 10 years. one is more expensive and has proven it self year after year. it just depends what your needs and whats are http://www.freshalloy.com/

ken

BensonLovesDrifting
12-28-2001, 03:54 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by old_s13:
Situation #2:

"gee, look at this.. its a name-brand knock-off that allows you to put those cool blue bulbs. all the quality replacements cost $90+, these are only 30 bucks!"
Man oh man, when will you people STOP buying sh1t? http://www.freshalloy.com/ If its not Hella, its garbage people. Things cost money because they save money. Spend 30 bucks on some midnight moose headlights and thats exactly what you're going to get, a moose on your hood .. and at midnight too! Congrats..

http://www.freshalloy.com/


<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

i know of a lot of companies that make high quality light bulbs other than hella.

**DONOTDELETE**
12-28-2001, 10:20 AM
Guys, there arent many BIG-BOY lighting manufacturers in the world. Hella/Bosche provide most of the European market with their lighting products. Osram/Sylvania/Philips provide a lot of OE manufacturers with their products.

To me, everything else is a poor attempt to make a quick buck. I dont support knock-offs, thats all. I didnt mean to get personal, but read on all the lighting forums and you'll quickly see how the big companies sell reputable products.. while all the rest usually offer low-quality goods.

If you're going to spend money on something and call it an "upgrade," then for chrissake.. spend it in the right place and make SURE its quality. I just dont like to see people saying "oh I have H4's and I spend 10 bucks on e-bay.. they work great" when chances are, they arent up-to-par and dont stack up even close to the mainstream.

Again, I dont mean to get personal.. because these are just lights. But yes, I do get pretty worked up with this **** because its lighting - its the only thing at night that keeps YOU safe. Install some poor lighting.. cheap bulbs, illegal HID, whatever.. and not only do you perform worse than stock, but you can risk killing others. Glare blinds people, glare causes accidents.

Have you guys ever seen some of those "diamond-cut" H4's that some companies sell? Last I saw them in person, they were made of plastic and had a very poor lighting pattern, if any! I dunno.. I'm just an old-schooler. If I pay money for something, I want to make sure its damn top-knotch.. thats all.

**DONOTDELETE**
12-28-2001, 10:27 AM
Crap:
http://shop.store.yahoo.com/racinglab/raysquartyps.html
http://shop.store.yahoo.com/racinglab/h4sealbeamco3.html
http://www.piaa.com/piaabulbs.html

uiuc240
12-28-2001, 01:37 PM
Mike, you've struck a chord with me here, man. I have the Hella H4 conversion, but I'm running the PIAA Xtreme White lights and I prefer them over the standard Hella H4 bulbs. They produce whiter, brighter light (I tested them back to back). I know that you like lighting, and I would like to buy your HID setup, but right now my money is going to SR parts and suspension bits. I'm just saying to watch what you say when it comes to dogging aftermarket parts. Just because it isn't what you use, doesn't mean it's crap.

Eric http://www.freshalloy.com/

**DONOTDELETE**
12-28-2001, 02:25 PM
I know some PIAA lamps are decent, but are they higher wattage? Watt for watt, there should be no difference in lumens output UNLESS the bulb's gas contents are different. If so, then those bulbs shouldnt have coating on them, they should be clear.

At ~$80/pair, PIAA's products are damn well over-priced.. cosidering Hella sells their Optilux +30's at around $35/pair.

ps: Btw eric, I'm not trying to get personal.. because afterall, we're talking about fukking light bulbs and preferences! http://www.freshalloy.com/ Thanks for the compliments on my light kit tho..

"Just because it isn't what you use, doesn't mean it's crap."

pps: Eric, I am not talking crap because its not what *I* personally use.. I am talking crap because when compared with comparable bulbs - they DONT perform as well, period. Checkout the Philips lighting forums online.. MANY people will tell you that these coated bulbs are a joke and deceiving to the eye. They way light registers to the eye is also confusing. Blue light in general is NOT as good as yellow. The blue hue that HID produces is just an after-effect.. its primary light that it produces is white. HID's benefit isnt the color, its the power and efficiency.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by uiuc240:
Mike, you've struck a chord with me here, man. I have the Hella H4 conversion, but I'm running the PIAA Xtreme White lights and I prefer them over the standard Hella H4 bulbs. They produce whiter, brighter light (I tested them back to back). I know that you like lighting, and I would like to buy your HID setup, but right now my money is going to SR parts and suspension bits. I'm just saying to watch what you say when it comes to dogging aftermarket parts. Just because it isn't what you use, doesn't mean it's crap.

Eric http://www.freshalloy.com/<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[ 12-28-2001: Message edited by: old_s13 ]

**DONOTDELETE**
12-28-2001, 02:45 PM
Quoted off of PIAA's site:

"No matter who you are or what you drive, upgrading to PIAA's Platinum Super White Bulbs is nothing short of enlightening. Not only will your car get noticed, you'll have improved visibility. By combining Super White Technology with a high power XTRA Halogen Bulb, PIAA's sharp looking Platinum Series bulbs are SAE and DOT approved. Upgrade your bulbs and be street legal in all 50 states and Canada."

So you know, DOT does not approve any lighting related items.. they only set the standard for US lighting requirements. Anytime I see "beam pattern corrected" or "DOT approved" I always start to wonder. I admit though, atleast PIAA does sell a bulb that appears to look like true-HID.. its just a shame that they take advantage of the aftermarket by selling them at such high costs. I mean, semi-sarcastically, who else is going to support the ImportShowoff/HotImportDaze crowd?

- Mike

[ 12-28-2001: Message edited by: old_s13 ]

KAkiller
12-28-2001, 03:19 PM
I've seen the knockoff sealed beam headlights on ebay and the hella ones around. I wanted to know from the people who honestly have tried the "non-hella" conversions if the vison of the car was improved. I'm not interested in if they give a cool blue HID look, just if they acctualy improve lighting.

Also I'm not sure if anyone here on FA has seen this old test that Overboost.com did on lightbulbs, but I found it pretty interesting

Overboost.com Headlight test (http://www.overboost.com/story.asp?id=102)

180Style
12-28-2001, 04:25 PM
the lites i got are rayberg, i like them no complaints yet. It does improve the lighting,
compared too the stock lites big time, alot more clear, also for the money i paid and how long they lasted i have no regrets, i would rather put my money where it counts the most too me, and that would be into my motor..
but thats just me....
http://www.freshalloy.com/

KAkiller
12-28-2001, 04:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 180Style:
i would rather put my money where it counts the most too me, and that would be into my motor..
but thats just me.... http://www.freshalloy.com/<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh I couldn't agree more there are much more better places to put money into, Motor, suspension, brakes, tires, track time and etc... But also after putting $3.5k in my motor its much easier to get the most out of it if I can acctually see whats in front of me.

**DONOTDELETE**
12-28-2001, 08:24 PM
Personally, I dont think suspension, brakes, and lighting are places you want to "skimp" on. At night, proper light is the only thing making your car visible. It allows other drivers to see you better, and also allows you to see other dangers: potholes which bend rims, drunk drivers who run red lights, and animals which can possibly end up on your hood. I think that is why I am so heated with this topic. http://www.freshalloy.com/

Anyway, when comparing lights.. its not as simple as just putting things side-by-side. You actually have to use a light meter in an appropriate setting to try to determine pro's and con's. Different headlights disperse light differently.. so its important to try to compare similar products. You cannot compare a DOT sealed-beam 6054 headlight with a Hella ECE 6054 headlight.. its unfair, different design/characteristics.

Anyway, the OverBoost test is a good comparison test. I am good friends with the owners, Scott Croughwell wrote that article.. and also wrote the article on HID vs Halogen which is also online.

If you guys really want to put some time into learning, read Sterns' page.. he puts it all into perspective:
http://lighting.mbz.org/

KenFuji
12-28-2001, 08:24 PM
i personally want to get a light yellow tinted head lights anyone know if they still make those?

ZENKI_KONG
12-28-2001, 09:14 PM
hey, old_S13, what's your opinion of catz and raybrig bulbs?

grayceifus
12-28-2001, 09:42 PM
I'm going to stick my neck in here and offer my 2 penny's worth. I upgraded my headlights to the sylvania/ge cool blue sealed beam units. they are about 13 bucks a piece and for the money you get a great upgrade. They are not blue, they are very clear, bright white...my friend who has blue bulbs in his crx commented on how bright and good my ligths looked. They don't stand much out in a sea of standard cars, and the beam doens't get lost on a wet road and best of all they are brighter looking than the "blue" headlights like so many people around my area have.

Like i said, just my 2 cents
Gray

**DONOTDELETE**
12-28-2001, 09:43 PM
drift-otaku&gt; yellow glass'ed bulbs do exist, hella sells some under the name "yellowstar" and they perform really well.

nc_s14&gt; catz and raybrig are both larger scale aftermarket lighting companies, but I stopped buying that stuff a long time ago. I guess some of their products are good.. but I am not sure which ones. They're basically like PIAA, nice looking but not all their stuff is fully-legal/high-performance stuff.

- Mike

SOHC240
12-29-2001, 10:58 PM
Well Mike, just to let you know I do have the hella's (not installed yet) but was just wondering how the others perform. Have you heard of the Matrix gr ones?

Anyways, I was wondering which would be the best bulbs to use in the conversions? I want bright white light, not yellow. HID appearance if possible.

Thanks,
Marshall

OP240SX
01-07-2002, 10:17 AM
I noticed at clearcorners.com the US spec Hella conversion uses HB2/9003 style bulbs, not the H4. What's the difference?

Also, I saw these on ebay. Any good?
Headlight conversion (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=600071759&r=0&t=0)

**DONOTDELETE**
01-07-2002, 11:48 AM
OP240SX&gt; In no means do I want to be rude, but the headlight kit being sold on ebay is absolute sh1t. Just my honest opinion, I cant understand why anyone would sell a headlight with blue bulbs and market them as XENON - but hey, people dont know better.. so I cant blame them.

Research this topic in the search engine and you will find a lot of good useful information on what makes a headlight look and perform well, as well as being safe.

- Mike / ClearCorners.Com

ps: The DOT version of the Hella 6054 is for enthusiasts wanting a *fully street legal* US-spec upgrade. You will get more light with a more accurate pattern, but not as accurate as lets say, the European ECE version. Basically, the DOT versions are for those who must pass very strict state inspections.

[ 01-07-2002: Message edited by: old_s13 ]

01-07-2002, 11:59 AM
Then again, you might be able to pass state inspection with E-code lights. NJ is one of those bass-ackward states that has safety inspections, and I passed mine with e-code lights. Then again, I didn't do it at a state-run facility, I did it at an independent shop, so...YMMV, as they say.

Asad

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by old_s13:
Basically, the DOT versions are for those who must pass very strict state inspections.]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

sph33r
01-07-2002, 01:46 PM
I see, I don't think that would annoy me too much. I do a lot of expressway driving and driving on roads that don't have very good lighting so I need something better than stock. Everyone who said the stock lights suck weren't kidding! I need a good light more than I need anything else so the ECE's might be good for me. Thanks for the info.

**DONOTDELETE**
01-07-2002, 02:01 PM
Asad&gt; the sharp cutoff isnt necessarily a bad or good thing, its a preference. From what I hear, Europeans prefer the sharp cutoff, while Americans dont like it because its aggitating. Again, thats only hear-say. The European standards have always been admired by many lighting enthusiasts for years. I read that Hella is actually working with DOT to try to up the standards and make ECE headlights legal here.

Technically, the ECE headlight is more advanced. It conforms to the European ECE standard - a good reason why so many people enjoy and rave about these lamps *SO* much. I can agree with the majority, I had them on my car for several years and was VERY pleased.

Legally, anything sold for street-use in the US *must* comply with DOT regulations.

So personally, if I wanted a good headlight for off-road use I'de pickup the ECE version and use some 55watt +30 bulbs - they provide crisp white output and perform very WELL.

**DONOTDELETE**
01-07-2002, 02:27 PM
Hey guys, I modified my bulb listing page with some more opinions and information on the pro's and con's of each bulb, I hope you find it useful:

http://clearcorners.com/products/hella/bulbs/


Again, this is a chart of the HELLA bulbs I offer WITH the headlight kits I sell. I do not sell the bulbs alone.

ttyl,
Mike / ClearCorners.Com

sph33r
01-08-2002, 12:10 AM
So the ECE are better technically for road driving? Michigan doesn't check anything on your car or even have yearly checkups so I want the best light for my money. I agree with Old S13 about buying a quality light since light is extremely important. I don't want APC crap on my car so why would I trust my life to their lights? So.. if I had to go ECE or US lighting, which would you suggest?

[ 01-07-2002: Message edited by: ffdet ]

d240t2
01-08-2002, 12:19 AM
What H4 bulbs do you suggest, Mike.

I was hoping to get something nicer to replace the cheap bulbs I got from PDM when I bought my conversion, while also getting a clear light for my clear front turn signals that would actually match.

Dennis

**DONOTDELETE**
01-08-2002, 12:24 AM
hey Mike, what do you know about the autopal H4 conversions?? they are on a groupbuy over on 240sx.org


drift freaq

BioSehnsucht
01-08-2002, 12:27 AM
Hey Mike,

How come the Low has a higher wattage number and the High a lower one? do low beams just have some built in massive resistance that bleeds of energy to be less bright or what? or is that just a typo and you got them backwards?

01-08-2002, 12:29 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ffdet:
So the ECE are better technically for road driving?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, I haven't tried the US-legal Hella "Vision Plus" lights, but I will tell you that the ECE Hellas kick ass. They have a very broad, even light pattern that illuminates the road well, as opposed to the "tunnel vision" effect you get with standard sealed beams.

The only downside to them is that they have a VERY sharp vertical cutoff to the beam...so if you go over bumps and such you can see the top edge of the light beam going up and down on the road and street signs and whatever else is in front of you. An annoyance, mostly...but some people might not be able to get over it.

Asad

**DONOTDELETE**
01-08-2002, 01:06 AM
dpro&gt; Since I have never used or even heard of Autopal, I cant say anything good or bad about their product. Since I have been working with Hella products for years now, they are one of the only brands I feel comfortable through my site.

BioSehnsucht&gt; Thanks for pointing that out, I noticed some misprints in my catalog and I guess I didnt get enough sleep when making that chart!

- Mike