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View Full Version : GT3071r .64 a/r DYNO!!!



Chins180sx
07-16-2005, 06:11 PM
http://www.tamparacing.com/photopost/data/500/medium/matt.jpg


Not to bad, however I think my HKS gauge from 1980 is reading wrong. My tq is about 60 ft lbs off what most do with the gt2871r with the same A/R. But 360rwhp is very nice. I am still in the search for more, but it pulls like a beast.

Here are the specs
GT3071R
Topspeed intake manifold
Tial 38 on the stock manifold
Deschwerks 600cc injectors
HKS step 1 264 cams.
and the thing that makes all the power possiable the Enthrapy Rom tune.

We did a good 22 pulls to get it where it is at, but its perfectly driveable and acts like a stock SR....just much faster. http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Forgot to add, this dyno has a small roller so where it spools is off, its more near or @ 4,000rpms not 4500 like it shows.

kovert
07-16-2005, 06:37 PM
that is a VERY bad ass curve. Im impressed. very broad power curve, and nice and long..flat tq.

the only thing not so impressive is the numbers. http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

BlackBomber
07-16-2005, 07:26 PM
Not to bad, however I think my HKS gauge from 1980 is reading wrong. My tq is about 60 ft lbs off what most do with the gt2871r with the same A/R. But 360rwhp is very nice. I am still in the search for more, but it pulls like a beast.

Here are the specs
GT3071R
Topspeed intake manifold
Tial 38 on the stock manifold
Deschwerks 600cc injectors
HKS step 1 264 cams.
and the thing that makes all the power possiable the Enthrapy Rom tune.

We did a good 22 pulls to get it where it is at, but its perfectly driveable and acts like a stock SR....just much faster. http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Forgot to add, this dyno has a small roller so where it spools is off, its more near or @ 4,000rpms not 4500 like it shows.



congrats chin. looks nice. how much boost?

cwdmark
07-16-2005, 08:38 PM
yep, how much boost? i was expecting numbers to be higher. that is a great tq curve, but why isn't it higher? hmm. its making about the same exact power my gt2871r, but a little later in the band and not as much tq. judging by the curves this turbo can prolly do a lot more.

Chins180sx
07-16-2005, 08:57 PM
I think scott said it was starting at 18.5ish. However I have a feeling my boost gauge is reading off. I have seen people do 330rwtq on the GT2871r but tq is dependent on boost, so I have a feeling that when I put in my greddy boost gauge, I can put the boost up more and have more normal numbers with higher HP

boostedS13
07-17-2005, 08:36 AM
http://www.tamparacing.com/photopost/data/500/medium/matt.jpg


Not to bad, however I think my HKS gauge from 1980 is reading wrong. My tq is about 60 ft lbs off what most do with the gt2871r with the same A/R. But 360rwhp is very nice. I am still in the search for more, but it pulls like a beast.

Here are the specs
GT3071R
Topspeed intake manifold
Tial 38 on the stock manifold
Deschwerks 600cc injectors
HKS step 1 264 cams.
and the thing that makes all the power possiable the Enthrapy Rom tune.

We did a good 22 pulls to get it where it is at, but its perfectly driveable and acts like a stock SR....just much faster. http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Forgot to add, this dyno has a small roller so where it spools is off, its more near or @ 4,000rpms not 4500 like it shows.



Weird... Scott did my friend's SR with a slightly smaller turbo (T3/T4 50-trim 49 lb/min wheel and 0.63 A/R turbine housing) and managed 445whp and 350 ft-lbs. His mods were similar... greddy intake manifold, tial 38mm, 850cc injectors, JWT S2 cams. Only big difference was he had a tubular manifold. Think that's what might be robbing you of power?

Side note... how did you manage the T04E compressor housing with the stock manifold???? http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Vapor
07-17-2005, 08:46 AM
thats nothing, i got t04S compressor fitting under stock manifold http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif

now we are definately racing http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Chins180sx
07-17-2005, 09:17 AM
To4e fit fine. I know I wont hit the same numbers as a turbo with the T3 exaust housing. a T2 just cant flow as much. However its deffinatly sleeper. So as soon as I find out my issue if I hit 400rwhp ill be more than happy.

cwdmark
07-17-2005, 02:21 PM
Forgot to add, this dyno has a small roller so where it spools is off, its more near or @ 4,000rpms not 4500 like it shows.


could this be affecting your topend numbers as well? 20psi and a little higher redline and you'll definitely get to 400.

Brianb
07-17-2005, 02:29 PM
I mapped three compressors. The 50, 2871 and 3071.

Plotted 7.5psi @ 2800rpm (boost onset)
Plotted 15 psi @ 4500rpm (max TQ)
Plotted 15 psi @ 7200rpm (max rpm)

For the 4th plot I took the 3071 and plotted 22psi.

The point I am trying to make is the 3071 won't hit its most efficient island until you get to boost pressures greater than 18psi and will suport it up to ~26psi.

The 50 and 2871 are much more efficient at 15psi and live rather happily up to about ~22psi. Calculations are always a little off from reality but I think (hope) this illustrates the point pretty well.

PS I included the 50 since Innovative has a dual BB version available that should compete well with the Garrett offereings.
http://home.columbus.rr.com/sprintturbo/Map-Comparo.jpg

Enthalpy
07-17-2005, 04:45 PM
I mapped three compressors. The 50, 2871 and 3071.

Plotted 7.5psi @ 2800rpm (boost onset)
Plotted 15 psi @ 4500rpm (max TQ)
Plotted 15 psi @ 7200rpm (max rpm)

For the 4th plot I took the 3071 and plotted 22psi.

The point I am trying to make is the 3071 won't hit its most efficient island until you get to boost pressures greater than 18psi and will suport it up to ~26psi.

The 50 and 2871 are much more efficient at 15psi and live rather happily up to about ~22psi. Calculations are always a little off from reality but I think (hope) this illustrates the point pretty well.

PS I included the 50 since Innovative has a dual BB version available that should compete well with the Garrett offereings.



Brian,

i hate to kill your little theory here...but the compressor efficiency differnece of 3% isnt going to make a hill of beans difference on the performance of either compressor. so dont go waste your effort on trying to factor that in.

PLUS...if you look at the compressor maps you will see that while the 2871 may be in its peak efficiency island at PR 2.0 it is essentially at the same efficiency point as the 3071R compressor at pr2.0 it's just that the 3071 housings allow a greater PEAK efficiency.

eitherway it doesnt matter. the compressor wheels are the SAME PART!! the housings just change.

71mm 56 trim GT35 compressor. (NOT GT35R....that is totally different)

so in conclusion.

good numbers matt. i think your boost gauge reads a bit low. T2 turbiune housings continue to be too dang restrictive for making really good power.

Brianb
07-17-2005, 07:19 PM
Scott,

I fart in your general direction! http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I agree efficiency differences are not the sole reason... what else helps explain the difference between this pull and what S13mark (for example) has done with his T2 based 2871?

Enthalpy
07-17-2005, 09:00 PM
Scott,

I fart in your general direction! http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I agree efficiency differences are not the sole reason... what else helps explain the difference between this pull and what S13mark (for example) has done with his T2 based 2871?




#1 differnt dynos. each dyno can read differntly

#2 differnt weather - we are at liek 90+ degrees down here.

#3 what real differences? mark did like 365 @ 21 psi if i recall correctly on a .64 housing turbo. Chin is doing 360 @ 18 psi on a .64 t2 based turbo. with a slightly larger turbine wheel. i'm nto sure what differences you are talking about but this dynos session did exactly what i thought it would.

cesar
07-17-2005, 11:19 PM
i think he's talking about the difference in torque output, which oviously has to do with the difference in boost pressure (21 psi Vs 18 psi)

SRENITY
07-17-2005, 11:35 PM
I fart in your general direction! http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif



What is the average air speed of a swallow?

Brianb
07-18-2005, 06:53 AM
What is the average air speed of a swallow?

[/QUOTE]

African or European? AHhhhhhhh! http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Chins180sx
07-18-2005, 09:01 AM
Ok, so i've determined im going to need a headgasket, some head studs and a bit of luck to raise the boost. However now I am contiplating what size HG to get, if I get a 1.8mm Headgasket it will lower my compression, and I can raise the bosot more to bring it more into its efficency range. However Or get a 1.2 mm Headgasket and raise the boost, just not as much. So what would you guys recomend for my turbo?


PS: my boost gauge was reading slightly high (roughly 2psi) so I will push it a lil bit harder and see if I notice any difference

Enthalpy
07-18-2005, 09:24 AM
matt,

how did you determine the boost gauge was reading high?

as for headgasket.

stock is 1.1mm thick. you do not need to go any thicker than 1.2mm dont waste your time. the reduction in CR will yeild slighly less power and off boost driveability. i would stick with something in the 1.1-1.2mm thickness and no larger than 87mm Internal Diameter.

cwdmark
07-18-2005, 04:06 PM
i think he's talking about the difference in torque output, which oviously has to do with the difference in boost pressure (21 psi Vs 18 psi)


you and scott nailed the tail on the donkey.



here's a comparison dyno, all on my car and the gt2871r .64 t2. you can see my tq output/peak is close to what the gt3071 does, but it could be exactly the same if your boost controller is reading higher than what it actually is. "spraying" means spraying water on the intercooler....... (ahem, your additional 10 or so whp you were looking for http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/grin.gif)

http://markshust.com/images/gt2871r64comparison.gif

the 3071 does have a better topend, and i noticed that too when i had it on my car. spool is really nice too...


id say run more boost and it'll be a very happy turbo.

MaxType 240
07-18-2005, 06:03 PM
Chin, didn't get a chance to say by when I left FL. Anyways, you're spending big $ on GT series turbos but you've hit a plateau w/ diminishing returns. Do more power w/ less - sell the GT & get a proper manifold and T series turbo, you'll be ahead in power & $$$ http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif Excellent curve though. I dyno my GT this Sat.

Jesse

dorimaster
07-18-2005, 07:16 PM
The 3071 can do much much more than u are getting, i have a 2871 and a 3071(no plots yet) but you can view ATP's website to see that it puts down 400whp to all 4 wheels on pump gas with an evo!! It has FAR more top end due to the larger exhaust wheel, which is a better match for the 56 trim comp wheel. Not to mention the transient response. Also: I have 3 housings for the same comp wheel which i will dyno and share, one is a t-3 housing with 3" inlet, another is a "b" housing with 2.5" inlet and the last is the "e" with a 4" inlet. Ill try them on both turbos and both sr's i have.

Pete

cwdmark
07-19-2005, 06:56 AM
you can view ATP's website to see that it puts down 400whp to all 4 wheels on pump gas with an evo!!


look at that lag... compared to the power output there are MUCH better options than the gt3071r .86 with that lag.

its funny how atp is running external gate on an internal gate turbo............................ and they won't want to admit that the turbo has major boost creep problems with internal gate when you call them. this pisses me off. that doesn't make it "complete bolt on"

dorimaster
07-19-2005, 08:54 AM
All but one 3071's are externally gated for that reason. You can get them in differnt trims, housings, a/r's and internal or external gated!! Lots of options. I dont call this turbo laggy at all!!

cwdmark
07-19-2005, 08:01 PM
All but one 3071's are externally gated for that reason. You can get them in differnt trims, housings, a/r's and internal or external gated!! Lots of options. I dont call this turbo laggy at all!!



i was referring to the evo... 400whp, full boost at 5k. that IS laggy.

dorimaster
07-20-2005, 10:06 AM
You seriously think 400whp AWD!! that quick is laggy!?, wow you dont know about turbos, there is NO other turbo that will get you there faster OR at a lower RPM. Full boost is before 5k RPM.(over 20psi!!) Obviously you dont know how to read a dyno graph when boost is not EVEN plotted!! You are looking at FLAT HP my friend.

Pete

Brianb
07-20-2005, 10:42 AM
Pete,

I am sure he knows how to read a dyno and there is a means to know when full boost hits without it being plotted. (hint: it has something to do with the TQ curve!) http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif

FWIW, the factory 4G63's hit 21psi at ~3500RPM with the STOCK turbo. Alcohol or 116 can net ~400WHP.

cwdmark
07-20-2005, 02:11 PM
You seriously think 400whp AWD!! that quick is laggy!?, wow you dont know about turbos, there is NO other turbo that will get you there faster OR at a lower RPM. Full boost is before 5k RPM.(over 20psi!!) Obviously you dont know how to read a dyno graph when boost is not EVEN plotted!! You are looking at FLAT HP my friend.

Pete


s14mark did ~405whp with full boost at 4.5k at 20psi, and enjuku did it at 4k. hmmm, maybe you don't know what you're talking about.. tq is directly related to boost.

dorimaster
07-21-2005, 01:54 PM
You guys do realize that ATP's Dyno is to ALL 4 wheels with stock cams and mani, right? That translates to near 500 on a 2wd car, and spools quicker than ANY turbo in its class. Apples to oranges guys. Full boost under 4k even at race-gas boost!

Pete

Vapor
07-22-2005, 10:52 AM
I think you are a wee bit optimistic on the power loss there chief

DeatschWerks_Dave
07-22-2005, 01:51 PM
Sorry I'm a little late to join the conversation, but good numbers Matt!

cwdmark
07-22-2005, 08:15 PM
You guys do realize that ATP's Dyno is to ALL 4 wheels with stock cams and mani, right? That translates to near 500 on a 2wd car, and spools quicker than ANY turbo in its class. Apples to oranges guys. Full boost under 4k even at race-gas boost!

Pete


than how come chin's dyno doesn't read 500whp?

dorimaster
07-23-2005, 02:48 PM
Maybe b/c he has some serious work to do, dont blame the turbo.