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View Full Version : How to seal a leaky turbo oil feed line on SR?



_Def_
09-04-2005, 08:45 PM
So I just tried everything I could think of to seal up the stock oil feed banjo line on my redtop SR. It is leaking where it bolts to the block.

I even put more torque than the FSM calls for just to make sure that was an issue, no change except the leak is slower(like a fast drip on a cold idle with 80-85 psi of oil pressure).

I tried new copper crush washers. No change really. Removed them and verified that the banjo fitting is making an impression on the copper all the way around.


It looks like the oil is leaking out of the bottom of the banjo fitting around BOTH washers.

I'm really just baffled by this, as I don't see how it's crushing the washers and still leaking.


I checked the line when it was out of the car and it was clear(just a quick blow through it to check). All the lines came right off my T25 that ran fine for a year, no leaks and no issues(I'm putting in a GT28R now).


So any ideas? I thought about maybe putting a little RTV around the crush washers then tightening it down and letting it sit for a few hours. My only concern is if this leak has any pressure behind it(since I don't really know what's causing it), then RTV won't hold, and I'd hate to toast my engine/turbo because my line started leaking and I ran out of oil. I could also try JB Weld, but that's pretty permanent, and I'm not sure if I could even get everything "undone" at that point. So I'd rather not go there.


The final option is just get some Takalines for a T28. My only hesitation with this is besides the fact that I *really* don't want to remove everything again just to install the lines(can you install the oil feed with the turbo still on the car?) is that I still have no freakin' clue why this crap is leaking at the block!!!



Any ideas? Should I just douse the car in gas and set the ***** on fire?

Flybert
09-05-2005, 02:41 AM
Is the banjo line flat on the block or is it twisted? You might have to twist the line so it sits flat to relieve any tension that might be causing the washer not to crush properly. With such low torque numbers for that bolt, this could be your problem.

It's also possible that you stipped the block and the bolt went in at a slight angle. That is very easy to do if the banjo was a little twisted. In this case, taka lines won't help unless you welded the fittings on.

Good luck with figuring out the problem. I installed a GT28R not too long ago and getting that damn coolant line to bend properly to reach the hole and sit flat on the block was a ***** and a half. I was super scared I was going to strip the block.

BTW, I don't think it's physically possible to loosen the oil feed line on the turbo while the manifold is bolted up to the head. I thought about that when I was considering buying taka lines due to my coolant line problem. O, and the chances you'll find them in stock is slim or at least it was when I was considering getting them.

_Def_
09-05-2005, 02:55 AM
It's sitting flat as far as I can tell. The washer has a nice crushed ring all the way around it.

I did have to run a tap through a few threads at the beginning of the block since the banjo bolt "popped" on the threads at one point. I have no idea why, as there was no tension on it(the easy way to install stock lines is grab them with vice grips and position them over the hole and try to make them stay there with no tension, then the bolts go in without too much trouble). But the threads are in good shape, and they hold torque.

I think I'm going to clean everything up again and then try some RTV. If that doesn't work, then it's onto some JB Weld and just hope I can loosen everything next time. I've thought about it all night and I can't understand how it's leaking and still crushing the washer all the way around...

The weird thing is that this same fitting/bolt/everything sealed just fine for over a year on my T25 with only ONE copper crush washer. I just had one washer between the bolt head and banjo fitting, and then it went straight to the block and sealed fine.

Kingtal0n
09-05-2005, 07:43 PM
that SUCKS! I had my turbo off 4 times yesterday, because my water feed line had rust holes in it! I would braze one, then find another after putting it back on. what a PAIN!!!! I hate those lines.

I silicone is not the answer, it will most def. give up. JB weld is not exactly a good idea either, its more like plastic, and the oil feed area (surrounding metal) is inpregnated with oil from years of it flowing by, it is unlikelly JB weld will stick to anything in that area regardless of your effeorts to clean it up. Oh yeah, it will stop the leak for about a week.

the BEST thing to do, would be remove the turbo and inspect the site where the banjo bolt goes in. inspect the banjo bolt. Double check your crush washers, and inspect the oil feed line. perhaps the line has cracked where the banjo fitting begins (had a line do that before) perhaps the bolt has cracked from being overtightened (had that happen too) and perhaps too much torque is being applied, warping the crush washers out of shape.

perhaps the threads are not sealing properly because of high traffic over the years, simply try using some teflon tape if that is the case, it may save you massive amounts of trouble and time, and you dont even have to take the turbo off to try that.

cwdmark
09-05-2005, 07:50 PM
I silicone is not the answer, it will most def. give up. JB weld is not exactly a good idea either, its more like plastic, and the oil feed area (surrounding metal) is inpregnated with oil from years of it flowing by, it is unlikelly JB weld will stick to anything in that area regardless of your effeorts to clean it up. Oh yeah, it will stop the leak for about a week.


i'd like to disagree. jb weld patched up my fubared oil feed hole out of the block. 8 months now, no leak anywhere. you have to make sure everything is super clean. i draw my oil now at the oil pressure sensor at the other side of the block.

Kingtal0n
09-05-2005, 08:05 PM
I silicone is not the answer, it will most def. give up. JB weld is not exactly a good idea either, its more like plastic, and the oil feed area (surrounding metal) is inpregnated with oil from years of it flowing by, it is unlikelly JB weld will stick to anything in that area regardless of your effeorts to clean it up. Oh yeah, it will stop the leak for about a week.


i'd like to disagree. jb weld patched up my fubared oil feed hole out of the block. 8 months now, no leak anywhere. you have to make sure everything is super clean. i draw my oil now at the oil pressure sensor at the other side of the block.



if you are PATCHING things up, then yes it may last quite a bit longer. You can REALLY goop it in there, on there, whatever. but its still ghetto as hell, JB weld tends to break down when heat cycled, and in the block it will eventually crack and leak. its not a MAYBE thing, its a FOR SURE thing. you can sand JB weld, melt it, warp it, and break it like plastic. its a lot like bondo... In a high heat high expansion place like a steel line bolted to an aluminum block, is not the best place to have it.

If _def_ attempts to JB weld his Banjo bolt in there, only BAD things will happen. maybe not today, but eventually, for SURE. and with his luck, probably halfway down a track somewhere.

_Def_
09-05-2005, 09:28 PM
haha - probably would happen halfway down the back straight...

I'm thinking of trying out the RTV. Since the clearances are small it *should* hold. It holds up to stuff around the water pump and diff area fine.

I looked at the banjo fitting the best I could for a leak/crack, but it looks fine. It is definitely coming around the crush washers.

I'll try the RTV thing tomorrow and let everyone know how it goes.

cwdmark
09-05-2005, 10:19 PM
if you're trying that route... go ultra high temp copper rtv. its the thickest and sticks the best.

i still dont know why jb weld is ghetto as hell. maybe its just the name of it. jb weld is permanent. right from their web site, it even supports temp fluctuations up to 500F.

its fine if you dont like something, but don't make up [censored].

BlackBomber
09-05-2005, 10:51 PM
haha - probably would happen halfway down the back straight...

I'm thinking of trying out the RTV. Since the clearances are small it *should* hold. It holds up to stuff around the water pump and diff area fine.

I looked at the banjo fitting the best I could for a leak/crack, but it looks fine. It is definitely coming around the crush washers.

I'll try the RTV thing tomorrow and let everyone know how it goes.



did you replace the crush washers with the EXACT same diameter crush washer that came off the setup? I had the same problem. Thought while I had the turbo off I would replace the crush washers with new ones. Went down to NAPA and picked up some metric/standard crush washers. they were slightly larger in diameter than the factory crush washer. well guess what? leak city. put the old crush washers back on and tightened her down, no more leaks.

KAkiller
09-05-2005, 11:14 PM
Try using a rubber O ring in conjunction with the SAE copper washer it will help center it. Or try aluminum crush washers from Earls.

_Def_
09-06-2005, 01:11 AM
haha - probably would happen halfway down the back straight...

I'm thinking of trying out the RTV. Since the clearances are small it *should* hold. It holds up to stuff around the water pump and diff area fine.

I looked at the banjo fitting the best I could for a leak/crack, but it looks fine. It is definitely coming around the crush washers.

I'll try the RTV thing tomorrow and let everyone know how it goes.



did you replace the crush washers with the EXACT same diameter crush washer that came off the setup? I had the same problem. Thought while I had the turbo off I would replace the crush washers with new ones. Went down to NAPA and picked up some metric/standard crush washers. they were slightly larger in diameter than the factory crush washer. well guess what? leak city. put the old crush washers back on and tightened her down, no more leaks.



I actually used a smaller diameter one that I ground down to fit on the bolt. It is a very tight fit, tighter than the original washer.

I'm going to pick up some copper RTV and give it a go tomorrow. If that doesn't work, JB Weld here I come.

I have a Nissport distribution block where my stock oil pressure sensor goes, so worst case scenario I plug up the stocker and make a line with a 1/8" NPT and feed it from there.

Then it's time to clean up the ~10 lbs of cat litter I got soaking up my first "trial run" of the new turbo. hah

RDM_II
09-06-2005, 07:24 AM
I'm willing to bet it's due to a stripped bolt hole also. You may have cut just enough thread to not notice it going in, but once tightened it's allowing pressure to blow by. I put an S15 turbo on an S13 SR a couple years ago and had the same problems with lining up and securing the banjo bolts, and just recently on an automatic transmission swap with the cooling line fitment. I swear the lines bend when removed because both times I spent nearly 30 minutes trying to get the bolt back in.

bleach8484
09-06-2005, 12:31 PM
Im kinda in the same situation.... I stripped my block and added a Heli coil, and new crush washers etc etc.... Still leaks like crazy. I guess my last option is to get Taka lines to make me a steel line with a 14x1.5 fitting to thread it directly into the block. Sucks, cus i dont wanna pull out the motor.

_Def_
09-06-2005, 02:12 PM
Looks like the RTV sealed it. I think there was maybe a small nick in the banjo fitting, so there was a very small leak that crushing down the washer couldn't seal. I just drove it about 15 miles and everything checked out.

I'm nervous about driving it anymore, since my adjustable wastegate(guy said it was a 7 psi wastegate, but I was going to 12 psi and still had more). But 12 psi at 4.3k RPM was already using 80% of my stock MAF voltage soooo... there wasn't much more to give.

I have a Z32 MAF and some 550cc STi injectors to toss in, so I'll see how a rough S-AFC2 tune will work out until I get my badbiki megaboard up and running. The car feels like it really wants to go past 10 psi though, so I think this GT28R will tide me over for a little while.

trackstar
09-06-2005, 07:12 PM
Sorry to hijack this thread, but I have a related question and figured it would be better than starting a new thread.

I recently bought the Taka SS lines for my S13 T25 from Enjuku. I have to rip out the turbo to replace a blown gasket, so being the uber-preventative maintenance guy that I am, ordered a bunch of other gaskets and hoses etc.

The lines Taka sent me definitely do not have a banjo fitting. Both ends basically have a female brake line fitting (tech name escapes me). I havent had a chance to inspect the OEM turbo lines yet, I've just been too busy...do the Taka lines someone connect to an OEM banjo fitting? Did Enjuku send me the wrong part? Do I need to pick up some additional part?

Flybert
09-06-2005, 07:58 PM
You probably have the ones that use A/N fittings.

bleach8484
09-09-2005, 07:32 AM
Man.... I tried some fresh crush washers and RVT before I resorted to a steel line. And it worked, Im pretty happy. I actually used alluminum rush washers for a Honda TRX 400 http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif I had em here at the dealership http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif

trackstar
09-10-2005, 04:29 PM
You probably have the ones that use A/N fittings.



Yes I do. I went to the Taka website and noticed they sell two types, so I guess I should be set.