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View Full Version : Eagle Rods q's: The good, the bad and the ugly



Oni_kage
02-08-2006, 05:39 AM
Alright I have been sifting through old posts on eagle rods and most the negative ports are around 2003. I also read that they have worked on quality control and what not. Also a lot of people say they 'heard' about this failure and that. But here is what I am looking for if any1 can help me.

Who here has direct experience with failed eagle rods in there sr20det? Also if you have what power were you running and for how many miles.

Right now I am building a motor and I am considering using stock rods but atm i really don't want to take chances so i will prob buy new stock rods if I do go this way. I cannot afford to blow another motor at atm the rods are the only major part that is left stock.

Also if you have run eagle rods for a long duration with over 350 rwhp please chime in. I read that swedish 700+ rwhp sr20 uses eagle rods. Any1 have an update on them?

Thanks for your help

S15xedS13
02-08-2006, 07:58 AM
I would also appreciate this inforamtion. I do know that the Eagle rods are very similar to the stock rod design. What I do not know is if they use a higher, lower, or equal grade of steel, have a tendency to stretch, and under what conditions. The good info and the bad would greatly appreciated by people with experience.

a2low240
02-08-2006, 08:23 AM
I have been using Eagle Rods for years now with no problems. I have about 10 customers that we built motors for that are running over 300hp daily & weekend cars without any problems. The only gripe I have with Eagle rods is that the Piston Pin end of the rods have to be machined out ( probably best for clearances tho.) We have used these rods with Weisco and CP but prefer CP pistons for any future SR builds. +1 for good rods at a great price.

Angel
02-08-2006, 08:51 AM
I had one fail on the dyno at about 450 rwhp and 7500 rpm in a motor that had about 500 miles on it. Was tuning the aem and the motor let go creating 2 large "inspection ports" on either side of the motor.... snapped off at the big end of the rod. Motor hadn't seen any detonation and the machine shop that put it together has an excellent reputation locally. Who knows??

killjoy
02-08-2006, 09:26 AM
Honestly thats the first time I have ever heard anyone with actual failing experience. I think these rods are fine, but not very many have run them in 500+ buildups so maybe they seem fine because they have always been used in lower hp setups. I ran these in my last car and I thought they were fine. They are not the same design as stock and when you compare side by side there is a large difference. The Eagles are H beam and stockers are I beam. Stock ones are much thinner. i bought these rods for 315 bucks brand new so for me it was a no brainer.

However, I have never heard of someone breaking a stock rod where it was the actual rod that failed and not some tuning error.

If you can spare 300 bucks get them. Otherwise rebuild with CP's and be done.

BTW, i got mine for 315 shipped from Dyno Flo Performance Auto Works in Vegas. They used to be a sponsor oir something on the old 240sx board. I bought mine over 3 years ago though so good luck.

Angel
02-08-2006, 09:40 AM
Honestly thats the first time I have ever heard anyone with actual failing experience. I think these rods are fine, but not very many have run them in 500+ buildups so maybe they seem fine because they have always been used in lower hp setups. I ran these in my last car and I thought they were fine. They are not the same design as stock and when you compare side by side there is a large difference. The Eagles are H beam and stockers are I beam. Stock ones are much thinner. i bought these rods for 315 bucks brand new so for me it was a no brainer.

However, I have never heard of someone breaking a stock rod where it was the actual rod that failed and not some tuning error.

If you can spare 300 bucks get them. Otherwise rebuild with CP's and be done.

BTW, i got mine for 315 shipped from Dyno Flo Performance Auto Works in Vegas. They used to be a sponsor oir something on the old 240sx board. I bought mine over 3 years ago though so good luck.



Could have been a fluke, or possibly an assembly issue... just left a bad taste in my mouth. This car would have likley been at around 500 ish on a dynojet when this happened, but hp isn't nearly the source of stress on rods that rpm is, that's why I was so taken aback by this. I guess ymmv http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/smile.gif Hopefully this was an isolated ocurrence.

240Shorty
02-08-2006, 10:19 AM
I have been using Eagle Rods for years now with no problems. I have about 10 customers that we built motors for that are running over 300hp daily & weekend cars without any problems. The only gripe I have with Eagle rods is that the Piston Pin end of the rods have to be machined out ( probably best for clearances tho.) We have used these rods with Weisco and CP but prefer CP pistons for any future SR builds. +1 for good rods at a great price.


what are you talking about machining out? piston pin end? i slapped my on w/o out doing anything like that? http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/confused.gif

ItzGenX
02-08-2006, 11:45 AM
I didn't have to machine out the pin end when I slipped my CP pistons and pins onto it. I've ran mine for about a year now with over 350hp with no hiccups. If ANY end were to fail on these, I would have to say it would be the small end. The big end failing just tells me that someone didn't torque the caps correctly with the moly assy lube or plain out spun a bearing.

Angel
02-08-2006, 11:56 AM
I didn't have to machine out the pin end when I slipped my CP pistons and pins onto it. I've ran mine for about a year now with over 350hp with no hiccups. If ANY end were to fail on these, I would have to say it would be the small end. The big end failing just tells me that someone didn't torque the caps correctly with the moly assy lube or plain out spun a bearing.



Could be on the tq specs. I didn't look too closely at it, just gathered up my stuff and went home. As I said the guy who did all the internal work is highly regarded locally and has built tons of stout motors, both import and domestic... more than a few sr's and rb's fwiw. I'm just throwing what little info I have out there. I agree that anytime you see a failure like that and given the circumstances the first thing you would suspect would be an assembly error. shrug

The owner is now rebuilding with crower if I'm not mistaken and will look to finish tuning and max out the GT35R and jwt c3's before too long.

minime
02-08-2006, 12:56 PM
how would stock rods hold up to 475~500whp? I passed on the eagle rods because of the negative feedback and I didn't want to spend big $$ on crower, but now I'm starting to second guess my decision. I only plan to be revving to 8000 though which should give me a powerband a little larger than 3k rpms.

they do have arp bolts in them but the engine isn't completely together yet so if changing to crower would be a wise investment it would be doable.

Angel
02-08-2006, 01:13 PM
how would stock rods hold up to 475~500whp? I passed on the eagle rods because of the negative feedback and I didn't want to spend big $$ on crower, but now I'm starting to second guess my decision. I only plan to be revving to 8000 though which should give me a powerband a little larger than 3k rpms.

they do have arp bolts in them but the engine isn't completely together yet so if changing to crower would be a wise investment it would be doable.



It's been done, enthalpy and hybrid dynamics come to mind. Don't know how long they might last, but apparantly for a while at least.

ItzGenX
02-08-2006, 01:15 PM
I rev my eagles to 8k all the time with no ill effects. On my first motor, I revved it with stock rods to 8300 all the time. Nothing bad ever happened to that motor before I sold it. As for power handling, I would have to say that there is no DEFINITE answer for the stockers. They range anywhere from stock power to way up in the 500's. Failures were usually a oiling problem, bearing problem, or lean condition that ultimately destroyed them. Take it with a grain of salt, but the stock rods are some pretty tough sticks to handle for a casted unit. Going with forged will give the insurance in strength for those "whoops" situations and reduces the weight of the rotating assembly. Personally I chose the forged units over stock because I didn't know what condition the stockers were in prior to me tearing the motor down for a build up. It's about preference and money as always.

killjoy
02-08-2006, 01:27 PM
...to finish tuning and max out the GT35R and jwt c3's before too long.



This is an SR car?

PICS!

minime
02-08-2006, 02:04 PM
I rev my eagles to 8k all the time with no ill effects. On my first motor, I revved it with stock rods to 8300 all the time. Nothing bad ever happened to that motor before I sold it. As for power handling, I would have to say that there is no DEFINITE answer for the stockers. They range anywhere from stock power to way up in the 500's. Failures were usually a oiling problem, bearing problem, or lean condition that ultimately destroyed them. Take it with a grain of salt, but the stock rods are some pretty tough sticks to handle for a casted unit. Going with forged will give the insurance in strength for those "whoops" situations and reduces the weight of the rotating assembly. Personally I chose the forged units over stock because I didn't know what condition the stockers were in prior to me tearing the motor down for a build up. It's about preference and money as always.



well money isn't a problem. this motor has spent so much damn time at the machine shop (4 months) I have been able to accumulate a bit of money. The only issue is that I would have to take apart the shortblock and I would have to wait for the rods to come in if I ordered them (and possibly order new bearings if the rods at a different diameter).

Angel
02-08-2006, 02:06 PM
...to finish tuning and max out the GT35R and jwt c3's before too long.



This is an SR car?

PICS!



It sure is. Let me see if I can dig some up. I am supposed to drive it once it's finished... let's see if that ever happens, wouldn't be the first time I was told that and never got behind the wheel http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/frown.gif

slow_s13
02-08-2006, 02:57 PM
haven't had any experience with sr rods-but the guy in my engines class at school bought one of eagles' 383 stroker kits-his rods were out of round at the big end and small end-so he sent them back and got another set-they were out of round too! so he machined them and made 500hp....however when i measured my crowers they were perfect http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

killjoy
02-08-2006, 03:20 PM
...to finish tuning and max out the GT35R and jwt c3's before too long.



This is an SR car?

PICS!



It sure is. Let me see if I can dig some up. I am supposed to drive it once it's finished... let's see if that ever happens, wouldn't be the first time I was told that and never got behind the wheel http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/frown.gif




yeah would be cool to see. I have never seen a graph with c3's or even c2's for that matter. Just paid for my S4's today. Can't wait for them to get here.

minime
02-08-2006, 04:00 PM
i just ordered a set of crower rods. I figure the added insurance is worth the added headache of taking apart the shortblock.

I've already been waiting 5 months what is another few weeks.

robbbby
02-08-2006, 06:12 PM
I have been using Eagle Rods for years now with no problems. I have about 10 customers that we built motors for that are running over 300hp daily & weekend cars without any problems. The only gripe I have with Eagle rods is that the Piston Pin end of the rods have to be machined out ( probably best for clearances tho.) We have used these rods with Weisco and CP but prefer CP pistons for any future SR builds. +1 for good rods at a great price.


what are you talking about machining out? piston pin end? i slapped my on w/o out doing anything like that? http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/confused.gif



My eagles had to be honed to fit the CP pin through.

ItzGenX
02-08-2006, 08:09 PM
Wierd, I guess that's a hit and miss thing.

element240
02-08-2006, 08:32 PM
interesting thread...

my cp's and eagle rods went together fine with no issues.
also, eagle went from 5/16" to 3/8" arp bolts.
for the price, this is a no brainer when compared to used stock rods.

Angel
02-09-2006, 08:37 AM
...to finish tuning and max out the GT35R and jwt c3's before too long.



This is an SR car?

PICS!



It sure is. Let me see if I can dig some up. I am supposed to drive it once it's finished... let's see if that ever happens, wouldn't be the first time I was told that and never got behind the wheel http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/frown.gif




yeah would be cool to see. I have never seen a graph with c3's or even c2's for that matter. Just paid for my S4's today. Can't wait for them to get here.



Here are 3 pictures of the car and engine bay just before it was all buttoned up. I'll have to see about the dyno graph of where we were before it let go.

http://www.speedzoneweb.com/build/gallery/004.jpg
http://www.speedzoneweb.com/build/gallery/001.JPG
http://www.speedzoneweb.com/build/gallery/002.jpg

killjoy
02-09-2006, 10:49 AM
I like the setup but not the hotpipe though I am sure it performs fine. Nice ride.

Angel
02-09-2006, 11:16 AM
I like the setup but not the hotpipe though I am sure it performs fine. Nice ride.



Agreed, if it were mine, I shared his goals and I had his budget, it would be substantially different. All in all, from what I could tell before it went poopoo on the dyno, it was working well in terms of power curve and the like.

BillKlineVT
02-09-2006, 12:02 PM
Rhombus runs the Eagle rods and he put down 669 rwhp on his SR with them...
You can see all the specs/dyno sheets here if you don't believe me.
http://www.rhombus-tuning.com/t66sr20.htm

minime
02-09-2006, 12:30 PM
Rhombus runs the Eagle rods and he put down 669 rwhp on his SR with them...
You can see all the specs/dyno sheets here if you don't believe me.
http://www.rhombus-tuning.com/t66sr20.htm



and he also uses an SSA manifold proving once and for all that two wrongs DO make a right!


i keed, i keed.

a2low240
02-09-2006, 07:32 PM
and he also uses an SSA manifold proving once and for all that two wrongs DO make a right!



I guess some parts do age like wine then, Eagle must have stepped up their game and started cutting the pin end to size to cut down on phone calls about the piston pins not fitting. About SSA, well who knows. http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/confused.gif

240Shorty
02-09-2006, 10:11 PM
i think its crazy that he got that much with the SSA manifold...and everyone bashes it. For the price you cant complain about cracking...just freakin weld the damn thing. you will notice Rhombus did weld a support on his.

Oni_kage
02-10-2006, 05:16 AM
thanks every1 for your responses... From this I figure eagle rods are decent afterall... But i decided with the amount of money that is going in my engine why take chances... I just bought pauter rods...

S15xedS13
02-10-2006, 06:28 AM
Pauters are hot!!!

RyanZ06
02-10-2006, 02:26 PM
THat's what I said. With all the money in machine work alone, it isnt worth it to me, i spent the 300 bucks extra and got some Carillo's http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

jickel240
02-10-2006, 03:45 PM
I've been running Eagles for over a year now, and I have no complaints...they did require the little end bushing to be machined out a little in mine also.

RyanZ06
02-10-2006, 06:29 PM
just wait till you start making power !! http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

lol. :-*

jickel240
02-11-2006, 11:03 AM
just wait till you start making power !! http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/cool.gif

lol. :-*




http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/blush.gif