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View Full Version : Sr no start, have spark, have fuel pressure



**DONOTDELETE**
04-04-2003, 12:03 PM
Sr will not start, have spark (grounded to exhaust mani saw spark), have fuel pressure (at the regulator hose, sprayed all over when removed). and my injectors are clicking. now my car use to have cruise, but i did not re install it w/ my sr swap (1990 s13 240fastback). there's 4-5 harness plugs that i do not have connected, (2) are 2 wire plugs by the ignitor chip, and (1) is high press ps connector and the last one is comming from the relay box by the battery and has 1 wire going to a brown plug. other than that the previous owner had a alarm installed and cut the ground to the starter and ran another one to the underside of the dash so that ground from the harness is not connected, but the alarm one to underthe dash is...... god damnit i know this is kinda confusing to understand. but i know i can figure this out.

i'm gonna check forsome codes. http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/confused.gif http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/confused.gif http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/mad.gif

i got just about everything from heavythrottle. walbro pump, i have 2 ecu's 1 stock and 1 rep, blitz twin solenoid boost controller ect..... i had the harness done by HT too. well i've pulled and re installed the cas 2 times and i know i had it right the first time (it's a pain to get the 2 silver links onto the dots on the camgears). the fuel lines are right also the fpr line goes back to the tank and the 3rd runner line goes to the filter. i got new plugs from a 91ser but i didn't check gap (maybe i should?) other than that i only tested spark on cyl 1 so i'm gonna check the rest. i have 12 volts at the yellow/blck wire on my fuel pump connector.

also when i pulled my cyl 1 coil pack and the plug to check for spark as i cranked the engine, i saw some white-ish yellow powder blowing out of the spark plug hole, but the plug was not wet w/ fuel. I'm stumped and the kid who bought this car was suppose to take it yesterday. i just want it running. which fsm can i use to check the ignitor and cas?

iHATEstupidity
04-04-2003, 04:25 PM
other than that the previous owner had a alarm installed and cut the ground to the starter and ran another one to the underside of the dash so that ground from the harness is not connected, but the alarm one to underthe dash is......



there is no ground to the starter. there are only two wires, one is the main power line that is a fatty wire direct from the batt, the other is a signal wire that gives it a 12V signal to turn on. if either of those wires are cut, then that is most likely your problem. altho it is assumed that the engine is turning over with the starter since you are checking for spark...? if that is the case, then check all other extraneous wiring that was altered during the swap



I'm stumped and the kid who bought this car was suppose to take it yesterday. i just want it running. which fsm can i use to check the ignitor and cas?



are you a shop doing a swap?

THINK

S14GTR
04-04-2003, 04:55 PM
Are you sure that the sparkplug are not flooded ???

If you have the CAS OK, and fuel, injectors firing, spark.... there's only plug to check & Change too!

**DONOTDELETE**
04-04-2003, 08:05 PM
there is no ground to the starter. there are only two wires, one is the main power line that is a fatty wire direct from the batt, the other is a signal wire that gives it a 12V signal to turn on.



your right (stoner moment) sorry. the smaller of the 2 wires was cut and spliced into the alarm under the dash then run to the starter from there. the original wire is still in the harness and i could hook it back up. but your right it's cranking so that's not the prob.



are you a shop doing a swap?


nope i just like to swap motors, and my nissan has been sitting in storage for 3 years, 2 years w/ motor sitting in it.

**DONOTDELETE**
04-04-2003, 08:06 PM
Are you sure that the sparkplug are not flooded ???



you must mean fouled? they were definately bone dry. and i think i'm gonna replace them and regap them anyways, what's the factory gap?

carluch
04-04-2003, 08:23 PM
do you have the fuel lines switched? meaning, do you have the feed and return lines on the wrong ends of the fuel rail? try switching them... if you had fuel going to your cylinders, i dont think the plugs would be comletely dry or odor-free...

**DONOTDELETE**
04-04-2003, 09:30 PM
do you have the fuel lines switched?



tried switching them, no difference. i have the line from the fuel filter going to the pipe between the 1st and 2nd runners, and the return is going to the fpr.

carluch
04-04-2003, 10:01 PM
ok, that is how it should be...

checking trouble codes would be a very good thing to do btw...

did you inspect the plugs?
are they wet with fuel?
does the exhaust smell like raw fuel?

i know you have installed the cas, but have you checked the timing with a light?

to get a clearer picture, what exactly happens when you turn the key "on?"
do you hear the fuel pump?
what exactly happens when you crank it?

have you seen the engine run before?
have you done a compression test?

where in NY are you?

**DONOTDELETE**
04-04-2003, 10:50 PM
did you inspect the plugs?
are they wet with fuel?
does the exhaust smell like raw fuel?


yes, no, haven't checked.... will tomarrow.



i know you have installed the cas, but have you checked the timing with a light?



motor won't start how can i check?



do you hear the fuel pump?
what exactly happens when you crank it?

have you seen the engine run before?
have you done a compression test?



no i can't hear the fuel pump.... i wired it red to red. black to black... that u shaped redish orange hose was not reinstalled... when i crank.... motor cranks like it wants to start but will not catch... motor has not run since i bought it from Heavy throttle 3 years ago... no i have not done a compression test yet.

could the wires to the fuel pump be backwards>??? i get 12 volts to the yellow/black wire at pump... but i didn't seem to get any voltage from it at the top of the pump where wires are connected w/ some speacial covering that cracked off when we removed it (on top of tank top of fuel pump assembly, basicly first thing you see when you remove cover) i can take pics tomarrow if you want. car is not here.

Black2Forty
04-05-2003, 01:52 AM
so you cant hear the fuel pump? have you tried hot wiring it? just jump power to it and see if u can crank the car. if the starts u know u need 2 figure out why your fuel pump doesnt turn on.

carluch
04-05-2003, 01:53 AM
motor won't start how can i check?

right, what was i thinking...





no i can't hear the fuel pump.... i wired it red to red. black to black... that u shaped redish orange hose was not reinstalled... when i crank.... motor cranks like it wants to start but will not catch... motor has not run since i bought it from Heavy throttle 3 years ago... no i have not done a compression test yet. could the wires to the fuel pump be backwards>??? i get 12 volts to the yellow/black wire at pump... but i didn't seem to get any voltage from it at the top of the pump where wires are connected w/ some speacial covering that cracked off when we removed it (on top of tank top of fuel pump assembly, basicly first thing you see when you remove cover) i can take pics tomarrow if you want. car is not here.


ok, it seems obvious that you arent getting fuel delivered if the pump is not turning on(although you claim there is pressure)... dont bother with anything else yet, if you know that the pump is not working properly...
not sure if you wiring is correct, but you may want to reference heavythrottle's website to compare... if the wiring is correct, the fuel pump circuit isnt very complicated... is the fuel pump fuse blown? doe the relay click?
not too familiar with aftermarket sercurity systems (although almost all s13s ive worked on have had a ghetto unit installed half-assed) does your particular unit somehow cut fuel or effect it in any way? does the alarm work properly(as far as you can tell without the car running)?
right about now, a factory service manual would be worth its weight in gold to you... regardless if you find the problem, you should really get your hands on one (for both the chassis and engine)...







[/QUOTE]

carluch
04-05-2003, 01:56 AM
so you cant hear the fuel pump? have you tried hot wiring it? just jump power to it and see if u can crank the car. if the starts u know u need 2 figure out why your fuel pump doesnt turn on.

that is not really the correct way to diagnose the problem... but hey, whatever works i guess...

if you do choose to do it this way, at least fuse the hotwire...

iHATEstupidity
04-05-2003, 02:37 AM
do you have the fuel lines switched?



tried switching them, no difference. i have the line from the fuel filter going to the pipe between the 1st and 2nd runners, and the return is going to the fpr.



switching them isn't the correct thing to do.. it only goes one way, and the way you have it now is correct, so leave it at that. if you suspect your fuel pump, easy thing to do is pull off return hose from the hard line (leave it attached to the fpr), point the hose into an empty wendy's biggie gulp cup and then have someone turn the engine to on (not ignition on) and let the fuel pump cycle for a couple seconds, then off, and repeat. there should be fuel coming out of the fpr into the biggie cup consistently if the fuel pump is hooked up correctly and operational

THINK

carluch
04-05-2003, 03:59 AM
ihate, that is sound advice, but he said he doesnt hear the the pump coming on... either he has an extremely quiet pump (not likely) or its not coming on...

iHATEstupidity
04-05-2003, 04:37 AM
ihate, that is sound advice, but he said he doesnt hear the the pump coming on... either he has an extremely quiet pump (not likely) or its not coming on...



which is why, to be 100% certain that the pump is working or not, it is best to pull the fuel line, post-rail, and see if there is any fuel going through it. (this is also why i say you would want to go through several on-off cycles, to make sure the pump is actually pumping new fuel through the rail, and that what fuel is coming out isn't just residual fuel left in the lines.)

THINK

trsilvias13
04-05-2003, 07:30 AM
sounds like no gas. my walbro make a buzzing/quiet humming, i dont know how to describe it but u can hear it pumping. my stock one too if i put down my back seat. i have a s14

**DONOTDELETE**
04-05-2003, 03:49 PM
Ihate your almost exactly right i think. i get no noise from my fuel pump what so ever.... that's messed up. i'll check the fuse and relay tonight, as the first thing i do. then pull the line.



easy thing to do is pull off return hose from the hard line (leave it attached to the fpr), point the hose into an empty wendy's biggie gulp cup and then have someone turn the engine to on (not ignition on) and let the fuel pump cycle for a couple seconds, then off, and repeat. there should be fuel coming out of the fpr into the biggie cup consistently if the fuel pump is hooked up correctly and operational



but which line? you were kinda unclear, you said leave the line attached to the fpr and pull the hose from the return hard line but


there should be fuel coming out of the fpr into the biggie cup consistently



that doesn't make sense. so do i pull the line off the fpr or the return line back to the tank were it becomes hardline?

it's most definately my pump not turning on. i'll check it when i go over to my friends tonight, and post from there to let you know.

iHATEstupidity
04-05-2003, 05:06 PM
this is what i meant:
http://sr20.hybrids.jp/van/biggie_fuel.jpg
notice the fuel return rubber hose is left attached to the fpr, and removed from the hard return line that goes back into the tank. this way you can truly determine if any fuel is actually going through the fuel rail when you cycle the engine on and off. doing it several times will guarantee you that the fuel coming out of the fpr is new fuel delivered by the pump, and not just residual fuel spewed out by pressure.

oh yah, and i wasn't kidding about the biggie cup

THINK

**DONOTDELETE**
04-05-2003, 05:13 PM
hehehe, sweet that's what i thought you ment, and that was what i was gonna try. well i'll be heading over there in about a hour or 2 so i'll keep you all posted on what i find. thanks again for your help i'm sure i can get this thing started, i've done some other motor swaps and i go to school for mechanics and autobody (college) any other info would be great.

and what sr fsm should i use, i have a chiltons s14 manual, and the pdf sr and ca manuals (s13,s14,pulsar, ect...)

**DONOTDELETE**
04-05-2003, 11:15 PM
ok got it running. replaced the plugs and regapped to .035in and the problem was the fuel pump fuse was blown http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif duh :Hammer: everything works fine except my JDM tach. i don't really understand why, the yellow w/ red striped wire is connected to the yellow w/ red striped wire on the ecu and dash wireing. it must be the connector behind the cluster has come out or something....
the other problem is, the car stalls due to my make-shift non-welded bov to ic pipe coupler. i'm gonna buy a new one tomarrow. thanks for the help now i just got to see about setting timeing....

carluch
04-06-2003, 01:47 AM
ok got it running. replaced the plugs and regapped to .035in and the problem was the fuel pump fuse was blown http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/wink.gif duh :Hammer:



glad to see you got it running... thanks ihate, for straightening out his problem... guess we should leave the diagonostics to you...


if the wiring is correct, the fuel pump circuit isnt very complicated... is the fuel pump fuse blown? does the relay click?

**DONOTDELETE**
04-11-2003, 03:25 PM
i'm gonna check tps voltage tonight, i'm sure my iac valve screw has not been tampered w/ so i'm gonna re install the cas and turn the crank a million and a half times to get those damn silver links on the cam gear dots http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

**DONOTDELETE**
04-12-2003, 03:50 AM
hey just wanted to let you all know, i got it running good tonight. but my slave cyl blew out on the way home. someone said something about a pivot bolt not holding my fork in place for the clutch but i can't seem to find it in this pic.

http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/bf8cb1b2/bc/my+pics/__hr_tranny+nissan.jpg?bc.C8l.AaPG20Q.t

other than that. the bov was causeing a leak causeing car to stall, i found this out after resetting cas to tdc. checking tps voltage max 4.2 at wot. adjusted throttle cable. tends to be some power loss above 6k but mostlikely timeing. but big problem is clutch. i have to get this fixed http://forums.freshalloy.com/images/graemlins/confused.gif