SE-R vs. Z

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Driving down the road latest Gen NA Z 2+2 5spd pulls up next to me trying to race my slightly moded SE-R ( Cold Air intake, Greddy cat-back, Jim Wolf clutch...) His car, $tillen mufflers, F40 type spoiler and some OEM Z chrome rims. Well Mr. NA-Z tries to sneak past the SR20 powered machine, but his performance powerhouse is not capable of that. Light changes tire spin. 1st gear hes about 1 car back, 2nd chirps....almost redline hes about a car and 3/4s back, 3rd- we are up to 85 by now, hes 2.5 cars back. Mr Z thinks he can spank the little Sentra, I hit my oversize brakes, stop in no time and let the Z fly by.... needless to say I killed my own family member. Now for my other engine.... the SR20DE-T that I'm building up, there are a few TTZs around here that I need to school a bit, call it SE-Riously spanked 101....

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mike Jez:
Driving down the road latest Gen NA Z 2+2 5spd pulls up next to me trying to race my slightly moded SE-R ( Cold Air intake, Greddy cat-back, Jim Wolf clutch...) His car, $tillen mufflers, F40 type spoiler and some OEM Z chrome rims. Well Mr. NA-Z tries to sneak past the SR20 powered machine, but his performance powerhouse is not capable of that. Light changes tire spin. 1st gear hes about 1 car back, 2nd chirps....almost redline hes about a car and 3/4s back, 3rd- we are up to 85 by now, hes 2.5 cars back. Mr Z thinks he can spank the little Sentra, I hit my oversize brakes, stop in no time and let the Z fly by.... needless to say I killed my own family member. Now for my other engine.... the SR20DE-T that I'm building up, there are a few TTZs around here that I need to school a bit, call it SE-Riously spanked 101....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Coupla questions. What year is your SE-R?
Did you import the SR20DET? What other aftermarket components do you have on your SE-R? thanks

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I have a 1993 SE-R 5spd, superblack w/ ABS, Sunroof, radio w/ tape, floor mats, AC and Crusise Controll. I have 92K miles on my old motor. Currently I have a Place Racing Cold Air intake, that goes down into the fender well area and scoops all the air in through the factory 93 SE-R airdam (no dam on the 91-92s) I also have a full Greddy cat-back never model which has a small tip about 4". I have Jim Wolfs' clutch with Nissan disk. OZ Mito rims on RE71s and Kosei K1 Racing 16" rims for racing, I have bigger brakes off the heavy NX2000, which has 10.25" rotors, and are over 1" thick with huge calipers. I run Axxis Metal Master pads, no dust no squaling, they are awesome. I have Energy Suspension motor mount in it for a solid feel and no motor movement. I have a set of Jim Wolfs Cams which came in today via UPS, and I will be installing them on my motor tomorrow. Car runs like hell, it gots balls, runs 15.13s on street tires with just Cold air and cat-back, spanks every Civic Si around, and GS-Rs too. I ran a unofficial time of 14.9 on a G-tech with slicks. I have to take it to the track to make it official. For my other engine read my next post.

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my DE-T....
I have a brand new SR20DE long block that I got from work- I work as a tech for Nissan. It is currently apart in pieces waiting for parts to come in. I ordered a set of NISMO pistons, rods, main cap bolts, rod bolts and bearings. This will bring the compression down to 8.3:1 with a HKS metal head gasket for a Blue Bird. I am not going to be using piston coolers as I do not see any benefits from it when U run a huge intercooler to cool down incoming pressurized charge. I am going to use my Jim Wolf cams w/ their cam sprockets to retard the timing a little- valve timing not ignition timing. JUN valve springs, which I got brought down from Japan for me, ALOT cheaper than from JUN USA. Only 200 bux instead of 400 bux a set of 16. Head will be ported by ME and flow tested on a Bench Flow machine I have access to. Basically the heads exhaust ports will be enlarged and CFMd to my SECRET spec with port matched exhaust manifold. Runing Mr. Gaskets exhaust manifold gaskets. As for ECU its JWTs Turbo program with 555cc NISMO injectors and Mustang Cobra MAF, which is made by HITACHI just like Nissan ones. Turbo is a built to spec T04E/T3 with a large front mount air to air intercooler. 3" inch downpipe with O2 sensor provision and full 3" catback exiting through Apexi Dual N1 muffler ( love dual tips on the SE-R, older SE-Rs) Engine will be mated to my 92K mile SE-R tranny which has to be welded cause the case has some cracks in it and gears need to by Cyro treated for extra strenght. Going to use a top secret prototype clutch which has light pedal don't chatter and grips like a MOF. I'm planing to drive it on the street so EGR is ESSENTIAL and all emssion goodies. I plan on pushing about 250HP at the wheels while driving it on the street, its really fast with only 200HP in a 2400lb car, so 400HP which this engine is capable off will be just a waste of my tires. Only going to push it to 400+ limits at the track. If U have any questions for me on moddyfing ur SE-R or Sentra, lemme know. Laters

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That's an impressive SE-R you're planning to put together for a compact car...to put all that power to the ground effectively the first gen SE-R has a factory stock VLSD right?

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Yeah all 1st Gen SE-Rs had VLSD standard with a 5spd. But I mostlikely will go for a NISMO LSD for more grip.

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Did you fail to mention the Z wasn't trying? 222 Stock HP against .... maybe 145? and you beat him? maybe he was only running on 3 cylinders, i can't believe you beat a Z with a Sentra. what do you get in the 1/4 mile?

[GTR]

like many late model japanese cars, ie: supra, 300zx, and 3000gt, the non-turbo versions are pretty damn slow. think about the body weight. there's a good chance that the sr20de could take on a n/a z. hey, the new max has 222 hp, im sure a properly modded sr20 could take it on.

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Sheesh, can't see how you wouldv'e spanked him so badly. My old NAZ when stock would at least be nose-to-nose with a modified SE-R.

Wonder if his NAZ was a little sick or he just didn't know how to use that 7000 RPM redline to it's full potential?

Guess we'll never know but that's a nice feather in your cap anyway.

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I find the extent of the kill hard to believe also. However, it's quite possible. Considering that most modded N/A Z's run in the 14s and 15s in the quarter mile it's not too far out there. I'd say it would come down to the driver if that SE-R is running in the neighborhood of 14.9.

The horsepower is higher in the Z; however, so is the weight.

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a properly modded sentra Se-R would have to have turbo to beat a 90+ Z N/A there is no way a Intake, exhaust, and some Vtec stickers are going to make it drop an entire second in 1/4 mile. I Highly doubt you could take my Non Turbo 86 Z which is rated at a mere 160hp with 3200lbs to lug around.

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Why is it so hard to believe. And why would it be hard pressed to beat your Z. Modded se-r can get easily 150+ to the wheels(wheels not crank) and weights under 2700 I dont remember exact stats on the classic right off the top of my head. Yea yours is rear wheel drive but I have seen a many mustangs and heard about them going down to properly modded se-r's and not even turbos. Turboed it has been shown in a 200sx of an easy 11.30 1/4 mile. dont believe me goto www.se-r.net (http://www.se-r.net) in the multimedia section then videos and down load ben's drag run

['97 S14 SE Turbo]

Another tidbit is that the '91-'93 High port head SR20DE are underrated at 140hp. Some people are suspecting its up to 160. A friend of mine has one. It doesn't feel like it's 140hp. Also, these "classic" B13 are also factory weight reduced and for the ones w/o sunroof, they get pretty light and can challange many cars on and off the race track... Go to se-r.net to read about the one chasing the Viper GTS...

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i'm sure it's possible to beat a 300ZX with an SE-R. however, i don't think it's really fair to compare a heavily modified car to one that's bone stock. hell, even a modified chevette can run a 11 sec quarter mile, beating a C5 corvette. but of course, i'd rather have the C-5 (that race i saw on Hot Rod TV). just my thoughts

i've read the 300ZX TT can be tuned for 700+ horses (i'm sure the SE-R can be tuned for a lot). i've heard of Skylines pushing 1000+ horses, not sure of that's true but i'm no expert. racing a tuned SE-R against a tuned skyline, 300ZX TT, or 240SX would be more interesting

[This message has been edited by nsuguy (edited 04-27-2000).]

['97 S14 SE Turbo]

Some of Nissan's engine's highest output:

SR20DET...700hp...more like SR22DET-R
RB26DETT...1030hp...more like RB28DET-R

These are from what I've seen in Japanese magazines. Also, the VG30DETT engine is not popular for tunning in Japan.


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by nsuguy:
i'm sure it's possible to beat a 300ZX with an SE-R. however, i don't think it's really fair to compare a heavily modified car to one that's bone stock. hell, even a modified chevette can run a 11 sec quarter mile, beating a C5 corvette. but of course, i'd rather have the C-5 (that race i saw on Hot Rod TV). just my thoughts

i've read the 300ZX TT can be tuned for 700+ horses (i'm sure the SE-R can be tuned for a lot). i've heard of Skylines pushing 1000+ horses, not sure of that's true but i'm no expert. racing a tuned SE-R against a tuned skyline, 300ZX TT, or 240SX would be more interesting

[This message has been edited by nsuguy (edited 04-27-2000).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

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Well unfortuntaly Mike is getting rid of his classic. Just heard the news today about all his troubles. Sorry dawg hope ya get you a 240 with a sr20 or some sort in it. Hate to hear such bad things believe me I have had my share of them. Right now my friends block is screwed after breaking a bolt of at the thermostat housing. last resort weld the housing on which we are doing. So hope you stay active in se-r.net and keep us up to date on all the tech stuff.

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Nahh SE-R is a keeper, I am trying to get a new engine. Another DET. I do not wanna talk about how it broke all I can say it was broke when I got it. I just didn't check. SE-R can run 13s with good mods NA, SE-Rs put down close to 130HP at the wheels stock, older 86-89 Zs only put down 122ish at the wheels, I seen it on a DynoJet, I have good friends who own 2 of em and I seen them dyno anything from Civic CX with 57HP at the wheels to monster drag cars. U fail to mention that a 90+ Z NA only puts down 178-185HP at the wheels STOCK, and little less for AUTO. Well the Z weights in at over 3200lbs, SE-R weights in at 2400lbs, thats 800lbs and only about 50HP. I fail to mention that gear ratios on a Z are not as close as a SE-R. Also SE-Rs will WHOOP on a Z on a track, handles like a dream with the right TIRES stock. Sorry to burst ur bubble but is not what its all hyped to be, I reather drive my 4 banger than a V6 that idles like it has a BIG cam in it. Is it me or all VG30s idle bad when miles reach about 30K miles. I should know since I work on em everyday. U don't see even 10% of as many SE-Rs in the shope as U see Zs, they are very trouble-free cars. If my engine is not repleaced by another engine I will be keeping my SE-R NA and going to intall some WILD parts on it.

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Just got the email Mike good to hear ya going to keep the NA SE-R. Hope to see ya at the convention. Atleast now I know I can stay a little closer than if I was following you with the turbo in. Since we all are meeting up in Memphis.

But I just turned a domestic guy into likeing my car. He wants to drive it for me in auto-xing and hes a damn good driver. Dont know if I will let him but who knows. Good to see ya keeping your head up Mike

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Oh I am still going turbo... I am calling SOKO up tomorrow and having em ship another motor this way. There is something about that big 80mm Blitz boost gauge I got that makes me wanna see it go to 1.2Bar of boost on my SE-Rs dashboard. I sold all the parts off the DET and will buy another DET this week. I can't wait to have my car back on the road. So when U do follow me... its going to be untill the boost kicks in. SE-R convention in TX this memorial weekend will be AWESOME, I just can't wait to drive my car again.

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Oh great I get to suck tail lights what fun http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum//images/icons/grin.gif How come I get your email then come here and see the same stuff cool that you are going to stay turbo tho. Cant wait to see it and all the cars. The convention couldnt get here any quicker could it? Only bad thing is a 15 hour drive from the house but thats 15 hours of quality time with my baby.

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ok ok, i did some research and found a 200sx which seems about the same car as a sentra SE-r and it ran a 13.4 in 1/4 impressive. but thats not what i call almost stock either! I respect sentras i wanted one real bad awhile back. and yea i know they can be quick even without turbos. my friend has a neon with ONLY bolt on parts running 14.4 in the 1/4 mile. all im saying is i think my Nissan 86 300zx can beat your sentra with your current mods (intake, exhaust, and Clutch) actually as of recently im less confident since my clutch has 110,000 miles on it and its slipping kinda bad..

My Z has a cam, intake, exhaust, flywheel, and stage one suspension techniques. ... thats kinda why im confident :-)

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I hate being broke! and i hate living here in michigan. anyhow, i have seen dyno results for a stock N/A Z at 140ish

maybe when my engine goes ill put a SR20DET in it :-) hehe

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sorry to have so many posts, one more thing. you were saying about the gear ratios in the Z vs your sentra.. well i dont know what your sentra has but my Z come stock with 3.90 gears and the turbo comes with 3.74 i think.

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One thing is that a b13 sentra se-r is quite a bit lighter than a b14 200sx se-r. There are a lot of factors that go into the difference and the possiblities of beating your car. I do hate this my car is better than your car wars bunch of ******** waving if you ask me. Sorry for the french.

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Z <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mike Jez:
Driving down the road latest Gen NA Z 2+2 5spd pulls up next to me trying to race my slightly moded SE-R ( Cold Air intake, Greddy cat-back, Jim Wolf clutch...) His car, $tillen mufflers, F40 type spoiler and some OEM Z chrome rims. Well Mr. NA-Z tries to sneak past the SR20 powered machine, but his performance powerhouse is not capable of that. Light changes tire spin. 1st gear hes about 1 car back, 2nd chirps....almost redline hes about a car and 3/4s back, 3rd- we are up to 85 by now, hes 2.5 cars back. Mr Z thinks he can spank the little Sentra, I hit my oversize brakes, stop in no time and let the Z fly by.... needless to say I killed my own family member. Now for my other engine.... the SR20DE-T that I'm building up, there are a few TTZs around here that I need to school a bit, call it SE-Riously spanked 101....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
A N/A 2 plus 2 300zx is a pig.You might as well have raced an Xterra!

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Dave86zx, have you seen www.z31.com (http://www.z31.com) ???
I can remember times when they had just started ...

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yeah, maybe his Z was sick. I do believe that a moded SE-R could keep up with a Z, but not blow a Z away.

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you are right blowcut. you can make a chevette beat a corvette, but does that mean its a better car? maybe. depends what you want from a car.

['97 S14 SE Turbo]

I can beat a corvette. http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum//images/icons/grin.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by dave86Zx:
you are right blowcut. you can make a chevette beat a corvette, but does that mean its a better car? maybe. depends what you want from a car.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[**DONOTDELETE**]

I can beat a corvette too. A ragged out 70's stingray (after emissions) The thing that would bother me most about sentra's are FWD. Did you guys email nissan about bringing the Silvia V-spec over here?

it was in a magazine they said if they get enough results they'll bring it over.

['97 S14 SE Turbo]

Hehehe http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum//images/icons/grin.gif

Mine was a C4 LT1 Vette.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by dave86Zx:
I can beat a corvette too. A ragged out 70's stingray (after emissions) The thing that would bother me most about sentra's are FWD. Did you guys email nissan about bringing the Silvia V-spec over here?

it was in a magazine they said if they get enough results they'll bring it over.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Ok, SE-R puts down about 126-130HP stock at the wheels, CAI intake gives it 8HP at the wheels and 4 from the exhaust, so lets say I'm at 140HP at the wheels, my car weights at 2414 with 1/4 gas of tank nothing in the trunk full interior and AC- no longer there- 50lbs of savings. My 140HP WHeel HP SE-R will take out a 170HP at the wheels Z, PERIOD. As for FWD vs RWD, there are 8 sec FWD drag cars, its no longer FWD sucks for racing... imports are changing the rules of racing, Like I said a SE-R will spank a Z, any Z but TT. Once U start modiffying the SE-R vs NA Z the SE-R will really shine, since stock engine is verry rev-unhappy. I drive Zs on daily basis at work, I can say that the only Nissans that are faster are SOME maxima "GXE" 5spds and TTZs 5spds ONLY. I have recently considered selling my SE-R- when my DET broke... and there is not a car that even comes close to my car for less than 19K bux NEW.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Ok, SE-R puts down about 126-130HP stock at the wheels, CAI intake gives it 8HP at the wheels and 4 from the exhaust, so lets say I'm at 140HP at the wheels, my car weights at 2414 with 1/4 gas of tank nothing in the trunk full interior and AC- no longer there- 50lbs of savings. My 140HP WHeel HP SE-R will take out a 170HP at the wheels Z, PERIOD. As for FWD vs RWD, there are 8 sec FWD drag cars, its no longer FWD sucks for racing... imports are changing the rules of racing, Like I said a SE-R will spank a Z, any Z but TT. Once U start modiffying the SE-R vs NA Z the SE-R will really shine, since stock engine is verry rev-unhappy. I drive Zs on daily basis at work, I can say that the only Nissans that are faster are SOME maxima "GXE" 5spds and TTZs 5spds ONLY. I have recently considered selling my SE-R- when my DET broke... and there is not a car that even comes close to my car for less than 19K bux NEW.

[Slack00]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by '97 S14 SE Turbo:
Hehehe http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum//images/icons/grin.gif

Mine was a C4 LT1 Vette.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I dunno about that...(being an LT1) what year EXACTLY was it? If it was after the rounded rear and front facelift then it probably was...but the original C4 in 1984 used the L98 (I think) and was only rated at 200hp....Corvettes have come along way in 15 years!.....Corvettes also weigh 3200 lbs.....

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i've heard C5's have a 4.8 sec 0-60 (i have seen various times for this, some as high as 5.7 seconds, which is probably too high). so those cars are pretty damn fast stock. i've read about that twin turbo vette they've got and it tops out at 227 mph. that's pretty insane. that would make it a Mclaren F1/Jaguar XJ220 fighter for a fraction of the costs. (i think it was about 100 grand after all the mods) the R390 (right name?) might get spanked by that corvette...

i'm not sure what the C4's power was rated at, but if you beat it in a 240, that's pretty good

['97 S14 SE Turbo]

The latest ones.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slack00:
Originally posted by '97 S14 SE Turbo:
Hehehe http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum//images/icons/grin.gif

Mine was a C4 LT1 Vette.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I dunno about that...(being an LT1) what year EXACTLY was it? If it was after the rounded rear and front facelift then it probably was...but the original C4 in 1984 used the L98 (I think) and was only rated at 200hp....Corvettes have come along way in 15 years!.....Corvettes also weigh 3200 lbs.....

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slack00:
...uh.....his 240SX isn't *quite* stock....check it out on the 240 discussion page under "what cars do you own?" or something like that......
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


yes, i realize this. i never said it was stock. after all, he goes by the name 97 SE TURBO (hope i'm close). that's pretty self explanatory

[Slack00]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>

i'm not sure what the C4's power was rated at, but if you beat it in a 240, that's pretty good[/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

...uh.....his 240SX isn't *quite* stock....check it out on the 240 discussion page under "what cars do you own?" or something like that......

Personally, I think its the slickest 240 this side of the globe...., and Hey '97 S14 SE Turbo, if you ever want to just sell it....consider it sold (to me!)... http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum//images/icons/grin.gif

[Mel E Bog]

Don't N/A 300ZX's only post quarters in the high 15's low 16's anyways? I know stock 91-94 SE-Rs post quarters anywhere from mid to high 15's. My cousin posted 15.47 in mine down in Fomosa before I learned how to drive it. That was on street tires.

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anything is possible these days. if the numbers are right, then the se-r (130hp to wheels-weight-2400lbs) has an advantage over the z (185hp to wheels-3200lbs) on a sheer hp to weight ratio.
se-r: 18.46 to 1 z: 17.3 to 1. on top of that, with the gearing not as tight, that's 2 more chips on the se-r's side of the scale. granted in theory, rwd cars have beeter off the line than fwd cars, places a chip on the z's side. displacement also adds another chip on the z-s side, however the mods, even minor, will add a chip to the
se-r's side. take into consideration driver skill/error probability and each side would lose a chip. (both drivers ARE human, i hope!)which leaves a final score of 2 to 1, leaning to the se-r. not to mention, IF the z was running 17's and the se-r was using 15's, the another chip to the se-r. (proven fact of rotating mass) which would then be
3to 1, se-r.

just some yummy milk chocolate brain candy for you to see.

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 2000SE:
anything is possible these days. if the numbers are right, then the se-r (130hp to wheels-weight-2400lbs) has an advantage over the z (185hp to wheels-3200lbs) on a sheer hp to weight ratio.
se-r: 18.46 to 1 z: 17.3 to 1. on top of that, with the gearing not as tight, that's 2 more chips on the se-r's side of the scale. granted in theory, rwd cars have beeter off the line than fwd cars, places a chip on the z's side. displacement also adds another chip on the z-s side, however the mods, even minor, will add a chip to the
se-r's side. take into consideration driver skill/error probability and each side would lose a chip. (both drivers ARE human, i hope!)which leaves a final score of 2 to 1, leaning to the se-r. not to mention, IF the z was running 17's and the se-r was using 15's, the another chip to the se-r. (proven fact of rotating mass) which would then be
3to 1, se-r.

just some yummy milk chocolate brain candy for you to see.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's some pretty good reasoning, from a broad perspective...

You realize, of course, that it's not that easy.....not all those "chips" are the same, right, so it wouldn't be entirely accurate to say 3:1 in favor of the SE-R? For instance, the 1" radial difference in wheel sizes wouldn't matter as much as, oh, say, the mass of each of the unsprung rotating hoops we call wheels? And displacement, of course, really hasn't as much of a bearing on a quarter mile run when you have a better indicator (horsepower) available. The torque curves might be a little different, which might account for a better 0-60 time. And, of course, the benefit of the higher of weight of the Z is the extra pressure on the contact patches of his rear tires,(which is, by the way, wider than the stock SE-R) which reduces lost traction due to wheelspin (Which, honestly, I don't think is really a problem for either of these two candidates). So put a bunch of chips back into the Z's pile....

My point isn't to say which car is better, only if you are going to start taking into accout things like the rotational inertia of the drive wheels, then you gotta go whole hog with it....

I think the best indicators is probably the hp/weight ratio, after which probably follows driver skill...the rest is just a wash, and to comprehend every variable, would turn this milk chocolate brain candy into Halloween-night caliber upset stomach.... http://smilecwm.tripod.com/cwm/killtard.gif

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a LT1 vette? thats a good car...

a LS1 is a much better challenge... ever run one? i love to run them... especially an automatic vette... heheh funny to watch the college kid's face when a 10 year old car starts pulling

the 2000 hardtop isn't anything to play around with however... if you aren't looking he'll get the jump and you'd better have the power to pull him back before its too late http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum/images/icons/smile.gif

i'm waiting for someone in town to get a Z06... i wanna see that baby run...

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oh yeah

forgot to say

as far as 2000se says with the more chips going to the Se-r

you forgot something called TORQUE...
thats off the line power and power to pull it through the gears http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum/images/icons/smile.gif
there's some reason that a NA Z runs 15.1ish and a SE-R doesn't http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum/images/icons/smile.gif

check the power curve too... i bet that the SE-R is more peaky and less broad than the NA Z.... peaky power can be good; but only when the gears let it...

[**DONOTDELETE**]

I don't believe that u could beated a Z that far.(you probably got half a car and you thought u got 3 cars.) With the modds you got, there is no way u could have pulled him that far. My friend drives a Z(4 seater), he lost to a modded prelude type SH by only 2 cars(my friends Z had a bad clutch and his head valves were really noisey, he drove back from North Carolina to Cali. ). I also raced a friends modded Integra LS, same horses as a SE-R(had all bacis and he port polish and B16 head) I saw him run at the track, and he was runnnin 15.5 to 15.4 all day long. Raced him and beat him by a car. I was runnin 15.3 to 15.2 stock in my 90 Z(2-seater) He didn't want to race you, thats all. He just wanted to taunt you. BTW, if I wanted a light weight, cheap car(I wouldn't choose a SE-R)I would have bought a 93 Civic hatchback, and throw in a hybrid LS-R motor, I would be running mid 13's and slap on slicks and a turbo(no nos) and be runnin 11's ez. U guys only talk about speed, what about the other's like comfort, design, quality, and finish. U can make any car go fast, it only depends on how much $$$ you got in your pocket. I bought my Z cause I like the way it looked and quality of the car, not cause I was gonna be a hardcore racer. It might not be the fastest car but at least it has the looks nobody copied and it still looks good and modern after ten years. Like the civics, s2000, supra and more, they all share the same front end design. The smile opening with a grill on each side. I don't care if you drive a SE-R or a Skyline, we all drive missan cars and they r great car makers, so just enjoy the ride. Peace out!

[Mel E Bog]

Well you'd have to take into account driver's skill too. I'm pulling 14.8X to 14.9X at the track in my SE-R with crappy street tires. The only mods I have are 19 degree timing, ghetto intake, KYB AGX's w/ Eibach sportlines, and an Apex N1 muffler w/ the stock piping. I haven't raced any Z's though.

Yeah the Integra LS motor does have the same hp as the SE-R but its nowhere near as fast. I believe those things run 16's in the quarter stock. My cousin posted a 15.47 in the quarter down in Fomosa when I first got my car, and that was stock, no mods at all, on street tires. Its the GS-R's that are more of a comparison to the SE-R when we're talking about performance.

Yeah you could go and get the LS-R motor with all its headaches and drawbacks. I know it does have some kick @$$ power but I have a few friends that run them in their Hondas and they have problems with them.

I'm just defending the point that the SE-R goes fast without swapping out its motor and has so much potential that hasn't been realized. You turbo the LS-R you'd also have to rebuild the bottom end if you wanna run it at that much power and not risk blowing your motor.

There are SE-R's out there hitting low 12's high 11's with the stock block and the engine that came with the car. There's a NOS'd 200SX that hit an 11 sec pass with the stock internals. We have two 10 second SE-R's out there running turbos w/ low compression pistons. I don't think it would be too long for an SE-R to show up in the 9's. Anyways this message is getting too long so...

Mel

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Thats good for the SE-R, but I was talking about honda's cause the others were talking about how light the SE-R is to the Z. I know that the Z is better equipped than the SE-R.
Thats why its heavier. Nissan could have not put in any luxury in the car, but wanted a luxury-sports car mix. I bet if they didn't, the cars weight would be around 2800 to 2900 pounds.

Back in the early 90s, nissan designers didn't think about making the Z into a drag car, thats why they added that anit-squat thing which makes the Z slow of the line where the weight transfer isn't enough to launch the car in 60ft.(like rx-7 and supra, the years where import drag got every popular, the weight transfer from front to back is alot to the point where the front comes off the ground). Nissan wanted a car that could run corners at hella fast speeds in that time era. But even with the anti-squat the Z's are still fast.(If the anti-squat wasn't there I bet the N/A would be runnin 14's stock, and TT would run low 13's.) The SE-R is able to run 10's, but is it still street llegal without hook up to pass smog. I know that SGP has a 10's daily driver Z. I had also heard that there is a 9 second street Z too, both cars still could turn corners at high speeds with full interior and big subs in the back. I bet those SE-R runnin 10's r gutted out, have slicks and huge turbo and not street llegal, and can't turn worth sh%^t.

Peace out!
Zzing is believeing!

[**DONOTDELETE**]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial[/img]quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PowerZ:
Back in the early 90s, nissan designers didn't think about making the Z into a drag car, thats why they added that anit-squat thing which makes the Z slow of the line where the weight transfer isn't enough to launch the car in 60ft. But even with the anti-squat the Z's are still fast.(If the anti-squat wasn't there I bet the N/A would be runnin 14's stock, and TT would run low 13's.) The SE-R is able to run 10's, but is it still street llegal without hook up to pass smog.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Do you mind explaining what this anti-squat thing is to me? I have never heard of that term before and am just a little confused http://forums.freshalloy.com/forum/images/icons/confused.gif. From the way you describe it I get the impression that Nissan weighted the car in a certain way to be fast in the corners but slow off the line. Am I on the right track?

[JonCarson]

I can't really explain it very well, but 240SX rear ends have the same "anti-squatting" effect on launches. That's another big reason you don't see a lot of 240SX drag cars.

If anyone read about JUN's Hyper Lemon Silvia Drag car in Sport Compact, you may remember them talking about it doing so well despite it's original rear suspension. The cars were simply not designed for drag racing--which is fine with me. Give me corners any day.